This morning babalu's George Moneo declares that "A blog is not a forum," and dips into Webster's to substantiate his claim. You see, George says, citing Webster's, a blog is a "personal journal" whereas "a 'forum' is a place for open discussion including the venting of a multitude of opinions." Of course, anyone who has blogged or who reads blogs knows that a blog can be a forum if its writers allow it. Certainly, if you permit comments to be posted and don't post a policy that defines your commenting policy, that is the impression you give your readers. If you aren't interested in feedback or interested in a particular perspective or view, simply get rid of the comments or make your readers aware of your commenting policy, right?
George takes on this subject to defend babalu's well-known practice of banning certain commenters. babalu's ban list includes, as George so eloquently puts it, "malcontents, imbeciles, idiots, liberals, leftists, commies, dialogueros, infiltrados, and general all-around a**holes [-Ed.]." Of course, these people are defined as such by the folks who write babalu, much like the threats to the Cuban government are defined by the Castro regime. Let's just say it's very subjective.
So, George says, because they are a blog where, by definition, open discourse and expression of ideas is not really present, it is technically impossible for them to censor anyone. In fact, George says, "We cannot censor anyone, only the Government can."
Well, which leads us back to Webster's, Moneo's Bible for blog conduct...
censor
1: a person who supervises conduct and morals: as a: an official who examines materials (as publications or films) for objectionable matter b: an official (as in time of war) who reads communications (as letters) and deletes material considered sensitive or harmful
Or, my favorite, Dictionary.com...
Censor
1. an official who examines books, plays, news reports, motion pictures, radio and television programs, letters, cablegrams, etc., for the purpose of suppressing parts deemed objectionable on moral, political, military, or other grounds.
2. any person who supervises the manners or morality of others.
3. an adverse critic; faultfinder.
Hmm. No mention of censors only being government employees. In fact, the Dictionary.com version uses the verbiage "any person."
So let's review.
By opening up babalu to commenting and by not making readers aware of their restrictive commenting policy, babalu certainly appears to the first-time visitor to be a place, indeed a forum, where their comments are welcomed. And they are, as long as the commenter agrees with the babalu message. If they don't and they post an "objectionable" comment as determined by one of the people supervising and examining babalu's comments, that comment is deleted and the commenter is banned.
That, folks, is censorship in it's purest form. And it's been practiced throughout history by tyrants and intolerant men who believe that their message is the only one that should be heard.
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27 comments:
There is no censorship at babalu as long as you follow their line. Isn't this what they left Cuba for? Wasn't the garden troll ousted from babalu?
I moderate my blog(s) and I say so on the about page. I don't think I've ever had to outright delete a comment, but I have edited some because of language and one or two may have gone over the line of a personal attack on another commenter. I look at it as if these are guests in my salon, I want widely differing personalities, views and opinions and you can't host that if you sensor what people say on topic or even shades off on tangents. But if other guests feel personally threatened ... well ... the discussion comes to a screeching halt and that sucks for everyone. So. Some moderation is essential.
Over the years I have come to the realization that there are blogs and boards designed to entertain, share ideas and information. And then there are blogs and boards dedicated to the admiration of their owners. It is absolutely pointless to rail at the latter type blogs and boards. They are what they are and they have fans that are comfortable with the "everyone thinks like me" safe zone. Some people genuinely need that and when anything threatens it, like this post of yours, watch the hell out.
Having personally done exactly what you are doing here to a very similar set of blogs I can say this with some painfully acquired authority ... I recommend you duck ... now.
censor - *eye roll* It's a blonde kind of day.
I have a fairly tolerant comment policy at my blog. The disclaimer states that "comments are subject to editing or deletion for offensive content." I get to decide what is offensive. Like ferfelabat, my view is that commenters are guests in my place, and like guests in my house, if they get offensive or rude, I have the right to warn them and then toss them out. I have banned only a few commenters, and that was for using the comments to make personal attacks on other commenters or going off on irrelevant tangents.
One thing I've noticed is that a lot of conservative blogs have very restrictive or registration-required comment sections. I've been banned from a number of sites for deigning to disagree with the post, and I never used offensive language or personal attacks. Ironic for those who claim to stand up more than everyone else for individual liberties and freedom of speech, but IOKIYAR.
George's post is nonsense. I don't know George, but I do know a couple other babalu writers, and I've been banned from Babalu - twice. (I posted there using an alias, so they likely don't know they banned one of their own.) Regardless of what George claims, none of my posts ever included profanity or personal attacks. All I ever did was challenge some of the nonsensical positions they take, e.g, that wet foot/dry foot should be lifted (without ever suggesting an alternate policy), or that it's the exiles who are really keeping the Bros. Castro in power (and not the Governator or some grandfather who enjoys a Cuban cigar while on vacation in Toronto). I still read the site, but wish it would take itself far less seriously. It was a far better site when it had fewer writers and didn't feel compelled to post something new every hour.
OK Ricky boy, let's test your theory and your grandiose words. Watch for my next comment...
Since he has always been thin-skinned about profanity, and in the event that Rick decides he is a "censor" too, what I just posted were George Carlin's seven words you can't use on television.
George:
I have a posted comment policy that I follow and I have applied it to your worthless comment.
You have once again demonstrated what a vulgar lowbrow you are and will always be.
Thank you.
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Oh, and by the way, I also want to thank you for finally solving the mystery of who was visiting SotP using a Rayner Software product that conceals your IP address. I see now you're using the Raynor Netshade product with you Mac.
While I know what you were doing at SotP [posting vulgar and anti-liberal comments] it makes me wonder what else you do on the Net that makes you want to conceal your IP so much that you invest in security software that masks who you are.
The possibilities are endless, given your temperament and, shall I say, social situation.
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Ummm? Isn't that being a censor, Rick? I'm having a little trouble understanding why you deleted the words after grandiosely defining what a censor is:
"censor - 1: a person who supervises conduct and morals: as a: an official who examines materials (as publications or films) for objectionable matter b: an official (as in time of war) who reads communications (as letters) and deletes material considered sensitive or harmful."
So using your own definition above, you're also a censor. right? Or, using your own words, it's "censorship in it's purest form." Sorry, Rick, you can't have it both ways... Otherwise you're just a [expletive deleted] hypocrite...
BTW, I do have Mac, but I do not use any apps from the company you mentioned. You can verify my IP right now. It's 66.32.4x.xx. There may be more than one person out there who thinks you a revolting leftist twit... :-)
It's sad that 'universal spectator' doesn't have enough native intelligence to see the difference between excessive use of expletives for the sake of offending, and stating a dissenting opinion.
Like Rick, I remove comments that are posted for the purpose of being offensive. I also remove the occasional SPAM comment. But in an open society, you can't honestly claim to love freedom and then not practice it.
If Babalu were truly agents for freedom, they would not need to fear dissenting opinions. You only need to suppress dissent if you believe that your position isn't fully supported by all of the facts. That's why in every dictatorship, freedom of the press is the first thing they eradicate.
Babalu's censorship reveals them for what they are; the flip side of Fidel Castro.
George: Is this really that hard to understand?
I do censor out comments that do not fit into my established policy that my readers are notified of before posting their comment.
Read my post again and maybe you'll understand that the issues are 1) you're saying babalu doesn't censor, when they do [w/o any kind of policy, I might add] 2) you say that censorship only applies to governments, when it doesn't, and 3) you somehow use convoluted logic that says censorship doesn't apply to blogs, or something like that.
I've never claimed that I don't censor and post long, rambling, nonsensical posts to try to explain myself.
And about the software...you're busted, George. What do I look like? A newbie? "You can verify my IP right now." Yeah, right after you logged out of it.
Actually, I could give a crap whether you use it or not although I do like to see who's visiting here. But it does make me wonder why you feel a need to use it.
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As one of the banned commenters, I have to give credit to SFDB for pointing out their ridiculous double standards. For a group of people doing everything possible to liberate Cuba they're surely not leading by example.
I tried commenting on their post addressing this controversy but I doubt it'll make it past the censors. BTW, we need a nickname for the censors, but I digress. Here is what I wrote so that others can read.
"This post makes me laugh but I feel bad for your reading audience. Your hypocrisy has reached critical mass and the light will soon shine on your double standards. If you really walk the walk, you'd post this comment and stop hiding in fear of criticism.
You have every right to put your personal journal on the Internet. However, when someone disagrees with you and you censor it, thats where you lose credibility. Good luck keeping it up."
Rick, you used the word "censor" not us. We freely admit to banning those individuals that we feel are nothing but propagandists for the regime. You're not exactly on our Christmas card list; despite your sorry views, and even though you fit one of the definitions in my post, you are not banned on Babalu. So? Are we censors?
You decided to delete my comment -- and said words are taken from a Supreme Court transcript, I might add -- so you cannot claim the high and mighty mantle of the purest blogger in the universe as you want to in your post.
George: "We cannot censor anyone, only the Government can."
Sound familiar? It should. You said it, Einstein.
Again, I'm not holding myself out as "the purest blogger in the universe," rather I'm taking you to task for doing it yourself. See the diff?
Please, just go away. You make no sense. You're pitifully vulgar. And with that software, you're creepy to boot.
Bye.
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BTW, Rick, are you still blogging on the taxpayer's dime? This taxpayer would like to know...
I'm smiling. Because I know that when you and Henry pull out the employment card, you got nothing.
You're still a loser, George. A creepy, vulgar, loser.
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I'm a creepy, vulgar loser, Rick? Thank you. From you, it's high praise. I just want your audience to remember how pathetic and hypocritical you truly are with your high and mighty opinions.
I'm sorry, George. I was wrong to call you a loser. You're actually a winner. A creepy, vulgar winner.
Forgive me?
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If Babalu believes itself solely to be a web log and not a forum, then they should disable comments altogether.
The fact is, they are intellectually incapable of debating and defending the issues they feel so strongly about, so they have no choice but to delete the comments.
They have every right to do as the please because it is their blog, but they don't realize how much credibility they lose each time they delete a comment.
If they allowed free dialog, they could have one of the best blogs in the country because it would allow us to debate one of the most important topics concerning South Florida.
But as it is, they are no different than the bullying Cuban exiles at Versailles and the bullying goons of the Castro regime.
As a blogger, I am proud to say that I have never deleted a single comment on my blog, even though people have left some pretty insulting comments towards me over the last year.
One of the most interesting discoveries I've had by allowing open commentary is that several right-wing conservatives have supported me in my crusade on photographers' rights while several left-leaning liberals have criticized me.
Regardless of where people stand on the issue, I appreciate the debates and it would be a crime to delete those comments that criticized me.
"The fact is, they are intellectually incapable of debating and defending the issues they feel so strongly about, so they have no choice but to delete the comments." True.
Val and George (the knuckle- draggers) especially, with Henry a close third. The rest of the commenters on the whole are pretty fair and above board. As in the earlier comments when things start to get tough they begin the name calling.
rick--
seriously: are you wearing a shirt with a big "S" on it underneath your everyday clothes? thank you for working to expose hypocrisy from those who cultivate it in this town.
Moneo is such a moron that he starts his rant on Babalu by quoting Adlai Stevenson, someone who betrayed Cuba exiles.
Le Poodle! Dude, it certainly looks like you have some pent up aggression from your blog exile. Hey Poodle, why not admit that you just don't tolerate oppossing opinions because you lack the intellectual capacity for debate? It's not about what you can do Poodle, it's what you choose to do. Babalu chooses the echo chamber and the masturbation circle. Well within its rights and well outside any credibility.
Oh, and by the way, I also want to thank you for finally solving the mystery of who was visiting SotP using a Rayner Software product that conceals your IP address
Something tells me we will be seeing one of the Babaluzers being busted by Chris Hansen on "To Catch A Predator"...
There's a huge difference between moderation and censorship.
The former promotes open and polite conversation. The second denies it.
There may be a thin line between the two, and moderators sometimes do make mistakes, but moderation is vital as are moderators who are willing to hear dissenting opinions.
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